Could the magazine be too low? Im almost through with my build, however I have noticed that my Seekins enhanced Bolt Catch in my Anderson lower is not locking back on PMags like it does on my aluminum and steel magazines. I deepened the hole to 0.480. I dont know what the limit is before you earn the edit privileges. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. The bolt catch problem can be solved by drilling the plunger hole deeper but Id first like to solve the feed problem. Let every feeble rumor shake your hearts! New firearms are designed around common Colt-pattern mags, and Magpul has to keep accommodating new designs with generational changes, or new offerings altogether, like they did with the EMAG. What the problem is: The lip on the un-fixed P-mag pushes the mag release/Bolt catch bar up just enough to catch the bolt group, but not enough to stop it. 11: Top of lower receiver to top of magazine release hole = 0.692. The plunger hole was too shallow but even after deepening it, the bolt catch still isn't pushedup high enough because the magazine follower is too low. I get asked a lot why, in almost all of my reviews or videos, I use good old-fashioned U.S. GI steel magazines in lieu of Magpul PMAGs, a popular alternative that most shooters these days are familiar with. Fig. This can cause partial engagement of the bolt catch and result in unintentional contact between the bolt carrier group and the bolt catch during normal weapon operation. UPDATE: after tinkering with it, Ive noticed it only happens on 30 round mags. Because of the cost difference, weight, compatibility issues, and not dropping free in many platforms, Ill stick with what I know works. For more information, please see our You can post now and register later. *, MISC Training Course Announcements & AAR's, Former Vickers Shooting Method Regional Instructors, Pacific Northwest Training and Networking, All Other Longgun Parts, Accessories, & Magazines (EE), Handgun Parts, Accessories & Magazines (EE), If this is your first visit, be sure to This will allow for easy removal of the magazine . Your previous content has been restored. If your upper and lower receivers are MIL-SPEC the ARMagLock will work. Not trying to be a dick, but can you summarize in one sentence what the rifle is NOT doing? I'd delete it if I could. The plunger and compressed spring are 0.490. I'll try and grab my camera. We STRONGLY encourage all users to always use the new PMAG magazine or some other 10 round magazine solution with a removable floor plate. What corresponding dimensions do you have? Repeat for the P-mags and note any difference. i have thermolds, and usgi mags and the rest of them work perfectly.. Scan this QR code to download the app now. Not a back-breaking amount, mind you, but not insignificant. Upload or insert images from URL. I deepened the hole to 0.480. Does your caliper also have a depth gauge that can get the internal depth to the mag catch as in figure 10? You are using an out of date browser. The cause could be one of the following: Bolt catch assembly is too far away from the back of magazine well Finger on bolt catch is too short Slight slop (looseness) on magazine, or magazine faceplate I too have seen issues with PMag followers. Measure the depth of the hole, first. I realized you can fix this by filing or dremeling off some material on the rear of the mag body, or by using whatever generation of magazine they implemented to fix this, or you could just arrive at my next point and save four or five dollars more by purchasing a GI mag. The BC looks the same so this is a non issue. There were no ammunition-related issues during the review. I sanded the top rib along the back wall of the mag near the feed and the feed itself and problem seems to have resolved. I am having no problems with Gen 2 or Gen 3 Pmags in a variety of lowers using mil-spec mag and bolt catches, which are also from a variety of suppliers. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. Also the follower rides the bolt catch up A LOT. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. P-Mag Follower and Bolt Catch Engagement *Issue Resolved! Cookie Notice Just did this, no difference. Morality is nothing more than expressions of people's personal taste/ Right? I recently bought 3 for my acr and when comparing it to the other mags i have for it, it seems the internal part does not come up high enough to lift the bolt catch. Fix: Empty Pmag gen 3 doesn't catch/lock bolt - YouTube Snipers Hide is a community of Snipers of all kinds, focusing on long range shooting, accuracy, and ballistics. Why not just ditch the PMags? I'd like to get measurements with lowers that did not start as an 80% because there have been reports of80% lowers having the same problem as mine. JavaScript is disabled. #5. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. PMAG Problems - Calguns.net Operation of any AR MAGLOCK products outside the standard method of operation or its original intended use may cause non-compliance to laws / regulations, and injury or death. Bolt Catch issues w/ Pmags + few questions - AR15.COM Next up is damage to the SCAR. The follower I wouldn't think should have witness marks on it though. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. They are reliable, well-constructed, and produced by a company that has a great reputation. I sent an email toDaytona Tactical support telling that themagazine catch hole is0.049 too low compared to others I've seen drawings of and am awaiting their response. Magpul needs to tweak their mold a bit before they make the claims they do. https://www.cdnnsports.com/catalogsearch/result/?order=relevance&dir=desc&q=Sig+bolt+catch. The witness make could be from the locking lugs on the bolt, mine don't have it so I can't say for sure. Founded by Frank Galli in 2000, Snipers Hide has been offering informational videos, podcasts, and other support to its users in one location. i have my pmags and i am just noticing a problemtried it out on 3 seperate lowers all of them have the same problem: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v488/derek45/AR/IMGP5612.jpg, the tip of the bolt catch that is supposed to be actuated by the back end of the magazine follower is missing the follower and end up not catching the bolt once the mag is empty. Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited. "And here remain with your uncertainty! A: Some states require the compliance solution be made permanent. Like CPT stated, it's supposed to raise it some and technically it can only go so far before the BCR bottoms out. When I release the bolt, the back end of the follower is sticking up, and the bolt will strip the follower right out of the top of the magazine if I let it go. NEVER use this product outside the standard method of operation as it will cause the rifle to no longer be in compliance and you risk arrest. His mags didn't ride the bolt catch up so we tried them out. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. edit: i just got them. Thanks for this HC, I'm going to inspect my Gen 3's to see if mine have the same witness marks. It was initially 0.323 deep. They are not as likely to happen with premium ammo yet the chance is still there. If you use PMAGS with your SCAR, READ THIS! - AR15.COM PMAG bolt lockback fix | Springfield XD Forum Mag still wobbles the same and the error still remains. I can manually push the bolt catch tab in to raise the catch higher. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. After depletion of your 10 round magazine, you must hit the bolt catch release to bring the bolt home. magpul pmag milspec bolt catch problem : r/ar15 Professional. i have a gen 3 pmag without the window and its kind of frustrating. That said, there is a reason that there are generations of these magazines. Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. How is it though that my. Seen here is a few examples of when a PMAG has to be manually removed: a problem that isnt present most of the time with plain old aluminum magazines. The plunger hole on this 80% lower was supposed to have already been finished. Re: Magpul PMag issues. NEW PRICING: All products have been reduced 10%! The bolt catch on the AR platform is directly in the center of the mag, so the shape of the notch doesn't matter on the AR, but on the SCAR, the bolt catch is offset slightly to the left. The bolt catch rides up but not on the black polymer part of the mag, but the follower. Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. It may not display this or other websites correctly. 80% ar-10 bolt jammed m5e1 pmag stuck 1 2 Next Mk3Mstr6Mchne0 Atlington, Washington Messages 12 Reactions 28 Apr 30, 2019 #1 this is kind of hard to explain, I am also pretty experienced with the AR platform, my M5e1 upper is assembled on an 80% lower. His problem is that the front tab of the bolt catch is not engaging on the follower of the PMAG, so the bolt won't hold open on the last round. The problem is pretty simple, the magazine's follower is failing to raise the bolt catch. Talyn said: Pmag VS Hexmag. The upper, lower, and jig are from Daytona Tactical d.b.a. Some rifles are just finicky. If that's what the bolt catch is suppossed to look like then my mags are a lil out of spec when inserted into the lower. No need to answer that last question. Special thanks to Ventura Munitions for helping us out with the cost of ammo, and a special thank you to you all for watching. Open the receivers to the maximum limit of the pin capabilities. It was initially 0.323 deep. Scan this QR code to download the app now. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. check out the. Sorry, I see the bolt is hitting the follower i could not see that at first.. Not sure if I understand the problem correctly, but I thought the bolt catch is SUPPOSED to ride up on the follower? The mags cause the bolt catch to rise ever so slightly and drag on the bolt lugs, which results in significant damage over time. (not my lower, but my exact problem!) Today I had some last shot hold open issues while using 20 round P-mags. This is not the case with PMAGs in many platforms. Have the power still to banish your defenders; till at length your ignorance, which finds not till it feels, making but reservation of yourselves, still your own foes, deliver you, as most abated captives to some nation that won you without blows!". That should tell you what's going on. We are all guilty of doing this, in one way or another. I ordered 10 mags from brownells after I saw they didn't ride the bolt up. If the solution to the feed problem involves a modification to the upper or lower, I'll test the bolt catch and take another measurement as shown in figure 5. The P-mags always functioned. After depletion of your 10 round magazine, you must hit the bolt catch release to bring the bolt 'home'. So, for people who only have AR-15s and only shoot AR-15s, its easy to get tunnel vision and just assume that PMAGs are the greatest, and the end-all, be-all answer for all shooters, while overlooking the needs of other people. PSA PA-10 Magazines, quick question. | Sniper's Hide Forum /r/ar15 is here for your favorite black gun links, build pics, questions and other tactical or practical information. Not up on the 80% stuff myself but we have a thread with lots of different brand bolt catches and the dimensions that may help on that end, please add to it if you have something not listed there. For me I had to shave off small pieces of the mag to make the bolt catch itself latch. My solution is to raise the bottom rear edge of the mag well by approximately 1mm to 1.5mm. I liken this to a person who lives in an urban area with an office job, assuming that nobody needs anything more than a Toyota Camry, while overlooking the fact that some people need things such as towing capacity, off-road capability, or more seats for a larger family. 16s and pmag Gen 3 problems!! | FN Herstal Firearms Pmag Problem | Northeastshooters.com Forums The mag on the left is the metal 10 round mag, the two to the right are Pmags. I was curious about how other magazines behaved in the lower so I measured them to simply verify reasonable consistency. It's a precaution against folks who like to cause trouble immediately after joining up. PMAG feeding problem, jamming on chamber face The ones I used were my friends and I checked the bolt catch before I shot. JWardJune 15, 2020 in Building a .308AR. Guide to modifying .308 Gen3 P-Mags to work in DPMS G2 If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. the bolt catch tooth begins at the center of the follower then teeters towardthe edge until it drops off. I dont readily know of a solution to the feed problem but I dont want to alter magazines to compensate for a receiver flaw. I recently assembled this Noveske rifle and bought 3. It isnt that they are bad (in fact they feed and run very well in certain firearms) but in my years of shooting I have simply found that other products may better suit a myriad of shooters. Mick 1 month later. We STRONGLY encourage all users to ONLY run premium ammunition through their firearm at all times. A forum community dedicated to FN Herstal firearm owners and enthusiasts. I find it interesting that in the "Bolt Catch Issues" section of the article, they mention that if the gun's bolt-catch fails to operate properly, instead of simply checking other mags, their first-line troubleshooting is to check the critical dimensions . New production Colt-pattern U.S. GI mags are four to five dollars cheaper than generation three PMAGs. It was initially 0.323 deep. TFB Review: Over 1,000 Rounds With The Springfield Hellion P-Mag Follower and Bolt Catch Engagement *Issue Resolved!* Mine seem to be fine after trimming of course. Bolt Catch issues w/ Pmags + Advice Needed - AR15.COM The gun will feed rounds from the PMAGs no problem. How To Fix AR-15 Bolt Catch Lock Failure for PMAG's 1.4k Why I Don't Use PMAGs Similar occurences? Note the different rear opening. I picked up a SCAR 16s last week and put 50 rounds through it with no problems at all (using the FN mag). 7: Bolt catch fully extended, plunger removed = 0.443, Fig. All Rights Reserved. AR10 bolt catch issues : r/AR10 As soon as my wife lifts our household arms embargo, I will have one. the tip of the bolt catch that is supposed to be actuated by the back end of the magazine follower is missing the follower and end up not catching the bolt once the mag is empty i have a gen 3 pmag without the window and its kind of frustrating. UPDATE: After seeing these pictures, I checked my factory mag. The mags cause the bolt catch to rise ever . In total, I (and friends) fired about 1,200 rounds in this review, 1,000 PMC .223 55-grain, about 200 reloads (a mix of 77- and 75-grain), and 20 rounds of Tula steel case at the very end. Also if you rest your gun on the mag when you shoot (by the way don't do this) it will shove most mags including FN factory ones. Fig. Try tightening the mag catch an extra turn. Replace the empty magazine with a new 10 round magazine and let it click into place. I don't and I didn't . honest. None of the 3 15/30 i have worked. Close the receivers back together and re-engage the rear takedown pin. Sounds like the pmag is riding a little high and rubbing the bottom of the carrier a bit. https://www.luth-ar.com/product/buffer-tube-spring-assembly-kit-308/, Bolt catch is from a TacFire .308 AR Lower Parts Kit (not for an AR-15). The plunger and compressed spring are 0.490. [ARCHIVED THREAD] - Another P-Mag bolt catch issue. To my knowledge, no PMAGs will work in the FS-2000 to this day without modification. While the weight difference may not seem like much to a civilian shooter who packs up his shiny, clean competition rifle into his Pelican case and totes it to and from the range in the family truckster, you hear about things like guys cutting toothbrushes in half to save weight in the military. NEVER attempt to cycle the bolt carrier group (manually or otherwise) or fire a round with the action open (receivers separated), as this may cause serious injury or death AND potentially make your rifle non-compliant with laws and regulations! Another P-Mag bolt catch issue? - AR15.COM All Rights Reserved. The main concern is the failure to feed. For me it's almost all gen 2 P mags. Can anyone offer insight to the cause of or solution to these problems? I thought about a low mag catch (the machining of it) very first, based on your info, but I wanted to know about that mag catch's internal parts first. If so, it would cause both symptoms. We have also seen similar malfunctions in a sandy environment using military spec ammo with a dirty, gummed up weapon. Depth of the hole? I'm pretty sure it's in the 80% Section. PMAG problems - Midwest PX - New Jersey Gun Forums I included a pic of the mag fully inserted, then a mag with the follower pushed down to the point of where the bolt catch stays flat. For a while you only had so long to make the edit and then never again. Press the AR MAGLOCK magazine release button. Hope this helps. Also, since the follower rides too high the pmags I used made a dent in the follower from the bolt. That one issue, right there, because in the previous pics, that bolt catch isn't sticking up enough to reliably get that bolt face every time. /r/ar15 is here for your favorite black gun links, build pics, questions and other tactical or practical information. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. It may not display this or other websites correctly. So, I marked it and I'm gonna keep running it through to see if it happens anymore. Clear editor. You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. Getting the Magpul PMAG to work with regular bolt catch Using PMAGs can actually do irreparable damage to an FN SCAR rifle. 10: Top of lower receiver to top of magazine release = 0.696, Fig. Insert the steel DPMS mag and lock the bolt back and look through the ejection port and note how much of the bolt face the bolt catch covers. Loctite (red) or epoxy the Allen bolt into the standoff (threaded barrel tube), and lightly drilling the bolt head facets with a 1/8 drill bit until the socket teeth are rounded. The Magpul PMAG is a great, well designed magazine that many people like and use in various rifles around the world, but over the years I have discovered that they are not the best option for me personally. PMAG Problems Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated However, when using the CH to keep the BCG to the rear, the follower can slip past the bolt catch when slammed into the magwell or when jarred or shaken significantly after insertion. How can I make my rifle more reliable with PMags? At the moment just keep posting as usual, the edit feature will become available. I have a DPMS pattern LR-308 under construction that has a failure to feed and fails to catch the bolt on an empty magazine. I wish I could edit the original post to correct this. I read through the threads dealing with this issue. You must log in or register to reply here. The table shows the measurements of several magazines and the left or right cartridge. I have a substantial cache of PMAGs, I already performed the PMAG mod by cutting the back of the mag so the bolt catch wont activate. Alex is a Senior Writer for The Firearm Blog and Director of TFBTV. I started construction with the lower at 80%. The plunger hole was too shallow but even after deepening it, the catch still isn't pushedup high enough because the magazine follower is too low. But if you're having this problem just take the flat of a knife blade and, holding the blade perpendicular to the magazine body, scrape a little bit of the plastic away until your bolt latch has free travel. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. Ok, so I have searched the hide and my googlefu is actin a fool like my pmags You must log in or register to reply here. Yours is 0.6640" for a difference of 0.028" which isn't as much as I expected based on drawings which is 0.049". I like the idea that I can accomplish a speedy reload by pressing a button and kicking a magazine out. Also check out this great, descriptive video as the Gen3 7.62x51 PMag followers have a slightly different contour which can catch the feed lips, and not rise high enough to engage the bolt catch properly on DPMS Gen 2 style bolt catch levers. . 4: Clearance to bolt catch is adequate when bolt is fully retracted, Fig. After installation of the ARMagLock the button is. Suggestions? What changed? I don't know if this is an indication of another problem being that the bolt catch is too far left. That might give a more consistent measurement between yours and mine. Iiiiffffff I owned one of those evil black rifles , I might buy the Hexmag brand when they went on sale for $6.95 ea. Pmag VS Hexmag The problem apears to be that the mag follower tab does not protrude out the back of the mag far enough, the follower wants to ride more forward in the mag body, and the end of the catch tab is not lifted upwards to active the catch. What's stopping your bolt catch travel, when you have that plunger and spring in there? Like you hear military folk say, Ounces equal pounds. And in the case of the PMAG, a full loadout saves the user a bit of weight. The problem apears to be that the mag follower tab does not protrude out the back of the mag far enough, the follower wants to ride more . Problems with failure to feed AND failure to catch bolt I could not find it for a few days so I checked it. My Colt LE6920 bolt is not locking back when the last round is fired nor when I insert an empty magpul pmag magazine. One new winner* is announced every week! View attachment 25288. Please refer to our installation videos and the instructions on your packaging. You cannot paste images directly. Powered by Invision Community, Problems with failure to feed AND failure to catch bolt. I deepened the hole to 0.480. How do I make the install permanent for use in states such as. PMAG "bolt catch interference" Issue with LMT MWS It is tight getting the depth gauge to the lower so the caliper may need to be slightly rotated but not in a direction that will affect the height measurement. Definitely try another couple magazines, including one from another manufacturer. With the mag catch removed, a mag can be inserted so far into the mag well that the follower moves upward beyond the point where it can lift the bolt catch. AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. I do need to know the correct distance of the top of the mag catch to the top of the lower as in figure 10 by using a depth gauge. TNVC/NGI Giveaway: 15 winners with over $7000 worth of prizes!! :??? They all functioned fine. Very carefully and pay attention to how the bolt catch actually works, if you did you should figured it out almost immediately. Some people used a 9mm bolt catch, others shaved out the bolt catch area on the mag itself. I didn't include that aspectbecause the bolt easily clears the bolt catch (figure 4) so I didn't want to throw in a red herring andconfuse the issue. Seen here is a few examples of when a PMAG has to be manually removed: a problem that isn't present most of the time with plain old aluminum magazines. Loading magazines at home means more shooting time at the range. Operation of an AR-15 without the receivers / action fully closed may result in serious injuries or death. Also, we'll be happy to correct or delete anything if you point it out to us in the meantime. Personally I wouldn't shoot it until you've got this issue corrected. To clear, get the bolt to move back by removing the floor plate of the magazine, remove the spring and follower followed by the rounds in the magazine and the 2nd round should drop out. Your enemies, with nodding of their plumes, fan you into despair! Try manually locking it back a dozen or so times then checking for any wear streaks on the top of the magazine feed lips. Yes I had to trim the left side rear notch square before the BC laid perfectly flat. Well, there are several reasons for this. Note: Firearm will not retain magazines until a replacement magazine catch solution is re-installed. This is one of my pistols. It did. The Fix: 1.) Of course, this is just my opinion, based on my personal experiences, and your mileage may vary. Just checked all of mine, I'm not sure how HC's ended up with a witness mark where it's at. This will severly damage your bolt group over time. Always use the firearm and AR MAGLOCK products as designed, engineered and intended for use. Paste as plain text instead, PMAGs are pretty notorious for not wanting to work in various platforms, including guns like the HK-416 and M27-IAR. This clearance is partially determined by the use of aLuth-AR .308 rifle buffer tube, spring, and weight [https://www.luth-ar.com/product/buffer-tube-spring-assembly-kit-308/]. If someone can answer that, I'd appreciate it. I personally dont see why I would spend an extra five bucks for magazines that wont drop free in all my guns, may or may not be compatible with new and upcoming guns, and my next point: wont fit in all my guns. Come join the discussion about optics, modifications, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! Pmags have worked fine in the past. First and foremost, I will readily acknowledge that PMAGs are a great magazine. All it takes is one out of spec cartridge that the extractor fails to grab leaving the cartridge behind in the chamber, going back then forward and pushing a fresh round against the cartridge left behind and you have the dreaded double feed where everything locks up. PMag Not Locking Bolt Catch : ar15 Check all your mags, especially PMAGS, but check all mags!!
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