Simply becauseIts like this or, my current favorite: Its a species behavior., Nan, No one understands what makes a character sing better than Michael Lewis. Maybe you want to borrow one of Kellys like, Its like this, but youre totally welcome to borrow my familys motto: Dont let the turkeys get you down. Its tried and true. Dalai Lama XIV, Cheryl, I should not be mad about this. Such is a reminder that success is the result of joined efforts and that all of us are touched by the ripples of others contributions. I mean, maybe I was projecting, maybe whatever he said in that moment, maybe if he had said peanut butter, and jelly, wed be talking about peanut butter and jelly, but it totally resonated for me in the way that a song lyric does where youre like, I dont know what that means exactly, but Im going to write that down, and put it in my wallet, and its interesting. Kelly Corrigan:Have you ever heard that potted plant theory? If you haven't heard of Father Greg Boyle, let us introduce you: a Jesuit priest who has a touch of Santa Claus in his affect, Greg Boyle has collaborated with thousands of former gang members to build thriving businesses and communities of radical acceptance in East LA. I was wrong not to try to know her, and I could just see it in his face that it was like, Okay, you understand. My mom called me maybe three months after my dad died. Kate is a young mother, writer and professor who, at age 35, was suddenly diagnosed with Stage IV cancer. Kilpy This is an amazing story. Im hearing all the music, Im totally tuned in to the right channel, and then just like that, I slip into those mundane irritants., Kelly Corrigan:And then I catch myself, and then I feel this sense of shame, and he said, Its like this. Thats the word. Kelly Corrigan:You know, that I had lost his favor for a moment, and I was just so ashamed. Click here for discussion questions for this podcast episode. Kate Bowler:You are someone who has gotten mixed up in all kinds of things, and I am so glad to know you. Kelly Corrigan:And how do we earn it? Diane, Okay. Im hearing all the music, Im totally tuned in to the right channel, and then just like that, I slip into those mundane irritants., Kelly Corrigan:And then I catch myself, and then I feel this sense of shame, and he said, Its like this. Theyre poking for that critical difference to hold on to, and I wanna hug em, and say, I know. Kelly Corrigan:Like, almost every time Im sure that if you just let me take over, I can make this problem go away. Im like, Yeah, right. Like, Today could be this day, well, you know, today I met you, now were friends, and who knows whats going to happen now? Kelly Corrigan:Hearts dont idle. And Ive talked to a couple of my girlfriends whove gotten divorced, and they say the exact same thing happens to them. Dont worry, and she said, Well, my problem is I cant zip my dress by myself, so I thought if it was a woman, I could ask her to come in, and zip my dress, and I thought, Thats the tiny moments that are so gut-wrenching for a new widow. The Honor and Weight of of Being a Role Model. Kelly Corrigan Wonders on RadioPublic Kelly Corrigan:And Im getting to walk with them way longer on their road, and I felt this sense that I could never possibly deserve that, that Im not that great a person, or a mom. And she said, Kelly, Im going to try to do the Uber to this wedding, and I was wondering if you can request a woman, and I said, No you cant, but you can trust it. Shes not going to their wedding, shes not going to pick out wedding dresses with them. Kate Bowler:Yeah. Kelly has also agreed to be my friend as part of her contractual commitment to this podcast. Hes just one of those people that you think, God, if I could get five minutes with him, Id just tell him my biggest problem, and hed just say something in seven words that would solve everything., Kelly Corrigan:So, eventually I went up to him, and I said, Im caught between these two worlds, this world where Im full of clarity and insight and gratitude, and Im seeing all the big colors of the world. Kate Bowler:Theres this other phrase, I was wrong, that has real power, and you learned that in a really intense way when your grandma died. Kelly Corrigan:And then she died, and my dad called, and my dad had nothing but positive things to say to me my entire life, and he said, You should have gone to see your grandmother more. Everything Happens : NPR She lives in Philly and I live in California. All moments, days, chapters are transitory and the good ones leave us as do the bad ones. Minds dont rest. I didnt engage with her. So, Dont eat a hamster is our version of Dont jump to conclusions.. Best Kelly Corrigan Podcasts (2023) Its what I said to my grad school colleague when she asked me if I planned to go into academia after we graduated. Kate Bowler:You and I are super chatty people, but you make an amazing pitch for silence, and I am all for it, because everyone always had these go-to things to say with me like, You can do it, or Youre so brave, and all the things that made me feel like I was on the other side of plexiglass. She's an author. Mary Anne, Mary Anne, Thats where relationship lives is in these tiny moments, and whether you are cognizant of that and tuned into that channel all the time, or not, that is the story of a relationship. Theres a whole world out there happening, and you can step into all kinds of things, and you dont need to know why youre leaving the house. Kate Bowler:Words matter. You start with, Its like this.. Maybe you want to borrow one of Kellys like, Its like this, but youre totally welcome to borrow my familys motto: Dont let the turkeys get you down. Its tried and true. Michael Murray on the Social Science of Faith Kelly Corrigan Wonders. Id say that there is definitely such a thing as a questioning Christian. Kelly and Kate Bowler dive into that phrase so often offered up to explain bad stuff: "everything happens for a reason." Kate is a divinity professor at Duke University and the bestselling author of three books. She had ovarian cancer, so she had fought it for seven years, and it was the kind of thing where I felt like I urgently wanted to deserve my life. Kate Bowler:Well, I accept. Please note that this episode references addiction and suicide. Its really wonderful to learn more about you and hear the ways youve connected with Kate and the book. And Ive talked to a couple of my girlfriends whove gotten divorced, and they say the exact same thing happens to them. Kelly Corrigan:Hey, thanks for having me. Its going to be great. I think we make life a little more interesting! So, its funny that that phrase really begat the whole book in a way, because I had been feeling this shame about not really earning my days here, and then Ed and I were at dinner, and we were talking about the difference between saying Im sorry, and saying I was wrong, and I was saying, God, its so much more powerful though in the humility in saying I was wrong.. It is a good reminder for me that I can lean into what its like now because change is always acoming. Kelly Corrigan:The magic of Tell me more is you start telling me what youre upset about, and I fall for the first thing you say, and I start solving for that. We can remove the first video in the list to add this one. Tell Me More with Kelly Corrigan is a series that inspires, educates and entertains. They hate it. Kelly Corrigan:I know, me too. Im Kate Bowler, and this is Everything Happens. She totally doesnt get it. Were jumping in way too soon and talking way too much. Surely, my friend, my lost and lovely friend, called for new words. Kate Bowler:I guess Ill see you soon. Touching on themes like self-belief, resilience, humility, and justice, this series normalizes the human condition and emphasizes our capacity to grow. Kelly Corrigan:I sat at my dining room table, which is place I never write, and I thought, Oh my God, of course I know exactly what this is. Kelly Corrigan:I mean, unless youre a monk, and youre meditating for 60 days in a mountain somewhere. Thanks so much for your refreshing, poignant, thought-provoking podcast. Kelly Corrigan:So, I used to go in there and write, and they have a meditation teacher twice a day at 10:00 AM and 3:00 PM, and at first I was sort of sheepish about availing myself of every single employee benefit, but sure enough, eventually I found myself sitting in there, and this guy was kind of amazing. Kelly Corrigan:I didnt die. Inspiring and thought-provoking interviews conducted by author Kelly Corrigan. Its probably cause of something youve been eating. Gratefully, I mean, I dont know why you went with, Everything Happens for a Reason, because Dont get crumbs on the baby, that could be the follow up. Kate Bowler:Im Kate Bowler, and this is Everything Happens. Kelly Corrigan Full Transcript - Kate Bowler Everything Happens with Kate Bowler Kelly Corrigan: Tell Me More 30 00:00:00 30 Read more about this episode, and get show notes, here. I was wrong, and that is very soothing, but then that took me back to this moment where I had gone to work for United Way after college, because I was going to save the world, and I was this total do-gooder. She lives in Philly and I live in California. Sometimes, were just lacking a bit of language. Kelly Corrigan:And Im getting to walk with them way longer on their road, and I felt this sense that I could never possibly deserve that, that Im not that great a person, or a mom. I need to hear what your motto is. Ive read Tell Me More twice already. Kelly Corrigan:Dont get crumbs on the baby. Theres a title. We should hold hands for a moment, as a way of marking the glory of a family dinner, and they do that. Its the title of my memoir-still-in-progress. She reflects on her love and loss through ordinary moments and everyday sayings. Diana, Kelly Corrigan:And I should not lose my mind over a shirt I bought on final sale section that didnt fit even though I tried to pull it over myself, and then it got stuck on me, and I had to cut it off with scissors. Its all this cumulative effect of a thousand minuscule moments. I end up saying to my therapy clients, to my friends, and to my daughter both Change is hard and the stage-specific version of CIH, Middles are awful. Middles are awful: we have to either find language for an ambiguous state or give up on finding it: hard, sweaty work. Kilpy Kate Bowler:Absolutely. Kelly Corrigan Wonders on Apple Podcasts 296 episodes Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Kelly Corrigan:Theres a thing Im aware of about eye contact between spouses, and you either make it, or you dont, and once youre aware that thats deeply meaningful, and that it has this kind of almost immeasurable, physiological effect on the other person, then you make an effort to look them in the eye, and that seems like such a small thing, but its actually definitional in terms of your relationship, in terms of whether its a good day, or a bad day, or a good interaction, or a bad interaction. She has a beloved podcast called Everything Happens. Thanks for sharing, Diane! Thats where relationship lives is in these tiny moments, and whether you are cognizant of that and tuned into that channel all the time, or not, that is the story of a relationship. We had several hamsters in one cage, and they can be cannibalistic, and one morning a hamster was missing, and another hamster had a suspiciously large tummy. Its a sin, its hell. In this season of "Tell Me More," listen to one-on-one conversations with musical icons like Jewel and Lang Lang, community leaders like Del Seymour, entertainment heavyweights like Constance Wu and Michael Lewis, scientists like Maya Shankar, and more. Kelly Corrigan sits down with Melinda French Gates. Its the motto I live by when my opportunities are too big, and my capacity and capabilities too small. I heard your friend died, and I just couldnt bear to call them back. It was because I had been selfish, and my dad caught me. She's a daughter who still mourns the loss of her dad, a mom to her amazing daughters, a wife to her fantastic husband, a sister, a good friend, and a woman trying her best to leave this world a better and a brighter one for future generations. Kelly Corrigan:Thanks. Kelly Corrigan:Well you know, sometimes the trivial is tragic. I go, Oh, thank you for that bit of suggestion.. Despair defies description. Kate Bowler:Today, I get a chance to talk to Kelly about some of her very best phrases. Then the ocean with its waves so vast, impossible to touch bottom, then a maze, then a mountain, then seasons, a natural disaster. I go, Oh, thank you for that bit of suggestion.. Plus, we learn how the same technique can actually reduce racism and prejudice. Team Everything Happens, Kate, May you find Christ, comfort, and companions amidst the questions! You've just tried to add this show to My List. Its cancer inflammatory breast cancer, with a twenty percent chance of living to five years. It kind of reminded me though, when I was little, my family used to have these mottos, but the mottos were stuff like, Dont get crumbs on the baby, or Be nice to mom. When I read that, I just kept thinking of how scared Ive been about what I call being a zombie. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us Hebrews 12:1 I do need to be reminded of this often There are only two days in the year that nothing can be done. Today, I get a chance to talk to Kelly about some of her very best phrases. He was saddled with depression and anxiety, which led to his trying to make himself feel better and reduce the noise in his head. This beautiful eulogy helps to paint the full picture of Ryland: a unique combination of funny, stubborn, difficult and smart. So, Dont eat a hamster is our version of Dont jump to conclusions.. You know, like it wasnt me. Join New York Times bestselling author Kelly Corrigan as she choreographs big-ideas conversations and personal truth-telling with some of the creative thinkers and artists who define our time. Our family motto: It isnt help unless someone asks for it. This forgetting, this slide into smallness, this irritability in shame, this disorienting grief Its like this. Kelly Corrigan. As Teri said, He didnt have a drug problem, he had a life problem. This is the way this has to be, and its right there. Go get mixed up in something. You can follow the conversation with Kelly on Instagram @kellycorrigan. Kelly Corrigan:One that Ive always liked is, Things happen when you leave the house. I think I like the sense of theres something out there that you can tap into. In other words, it could happen to you tomorrow.. Kelly Corrigan:So, my dad died in February, and then my friend Liz, whos the mother of three kids, 8, 10, and 12 at the time, died that December. At a time when so much feels unex The words we speak, and the words spoken over us. I mean, maybe I was projecting, maybe whatever he said in that moment, maybe if he had said peanut butter, and jelly, wed be talking about peanut butter and jelly, but it totally resonated for me in the way that a song lyric does where youre like, I dont know what that means exactly, but Im going to write that down, and put it in my wallet, and its interesting. I think we should be talking about five percent of the time. One of the hardest things Ive been wrestling with is not having any clear language for this weird place between sick and healthy, weak and strong. Claire, Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. Your email address will not be published. I was wrong not to try to ease her days in some way.. Kate Bowler:Yeah, I believe you. The ambiguity is quite isolating. Its the only way to keep the last bit of sanity. Kelly Corrigan:You dont always need such a plan, or an agenda, or whatever. Allison Wohl: A Toast Women | Faith & Story I even use it at the end of lectures like, Hey, this is the end of the 19th century. In, warm, insightful, often funny conversations, Kate talks with people about what they've. She died this morning, and I was just sick to my stomach. Kelly Corrigan:Youre feeling like ABC, not DEF. So thats the beauty of it. Both Kate and Kelly are remarkable women and in tandem they make for great listening. They reel and wander and fixate and roll back and reconsider, because its like this, having a mind. You also realized there was incredible parenting magic in the phrase, Tell me more. So, what is this witchcraft you speak of? For what Ive just seen in the last six months, I should be different. P.S. Like, Today could be this day, well, you know, today I met you, now were friends, and who knows whats going to happen now? Kelly Corrigan:So, I get it, but I spend a lot of time with them, and Im madly in love with them, really, really have this deep, incredible connection with them that I just value so much, and they are in her, and you know, theyre everything that was so important to her. I love your style and all your guests are fascinating to listen to with so much insight and knowledge. Kelly Corrigan:And it wasnt my turn for his attention. It was because I had been selfish, and my dad caught me. Nobody who is between identities they can tolerate does, it seems to me something Ive actively struggled with and expect to go hand to hand with again, whether tomorrow or the day after. After the potency of the crime metaphor wore off, I turned to the vocabulary of religion. The voice memos at the end of the episode are from listeners like you! Kelly Corrigan:I was perhaps proud about it honestly, and I was reading 7 Habits of Highly Effective People at night with my big fat yellow highlighter, and I was really full of attachment to this identity that I had painted for myself. Kate Bowler:You put in a strong argument, if I may say it like that, for just being close to one another. Ill definitely have to write this one down and bring it out on a particularly overwhelming day! Dont worry, and she said, Well, my problem is I cant zip my dress by myself, so I thought if it was a woman, I could ask her to come in, and zip my dress, and I thought, Thats the tiny moments that are so gut-wrenching for a new widow. Take care, What do you do when life doesnt fit into neat categories? The successes of independent and feminist Marie Antoinette provoke jealousy and rivalry. Kate Bowler:Todays episode is brought to you by our partners, North Carolina Public Radio WUNC, the Lilly Endowment, The Issachar Fund, The John Templeton Foundation, Faith and Leadership: An Online Learning Resource, and Duke Divinity School, and of course, Beverly Abel, Jessica Richie, and Be the Change Revolutions. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah, and theres forgiveness and acceptance kind of intertwined there that you know, youre going to forget. So much of what you both say resonates for me. Its not in my family. They reel and wander and fixate and roll back and reconsider, because its like this, having a mind. Kelly Corrigan:And thats the truth. I mean, that means shes with them. I was also living only maybe 10 miles from my very old grandma who lived alone, and I kept kind of meaning to go visit her, but its a lot easier to show up at work every day at the United Way, and get kind of righteous about all the people who work for money versus the rest of us who are working for the greater good, than it is to go to your grandmas smelly, weird apartment, and have weird conversations with an 88-year old, you know? You surely know about hard times, and I love that you are continuing to show up every day. What do we do when the labels were given arent necessarily the ones we choose for ourselves? Im so grateful to hear the ways youre connecting with Kate and Kelly. Kelly Corrigan:And he said, Thats a way to be a parent, which is to say to be there, to be available, to be within view, but not necessarily inserting yourself, because even though as your kids get older and older, it feels like theyre looking for you less and less, it is sort of a comfort to glance over, and see you there, and feel you there, and they would most certainly notice if you werent. He had things to do for days, and days, and days, and eulogies to write, and people to hug, and people to thank, and accounts to close, and cars to sell, and he had work to do, both emotional and just literally logistics. Constance shares her experiences as an actress in Hollywood both on and off screen: the privilege and responsibility of representation, being a true artist, navigating social media and an incident which took her to a very dark place.Special thanks to PBS for supporting Tell Me More and this podcast series. To learn more about Tell Me More: Stories about the 12 Things Im Learning to Say, click here. I didnt make her final days one bit better, and I lived there for two years. Kelly Corrigan:Now maybe Im going to go to Durham, and now maybe Im going to get my PhD in Divinity. Hosted by four-time New York Times bestselling author Kelly Corrigan, the show dives deep into each guest's life to pull out poignant lessons they hope others can use to find their own calling. (As consciously lesbian from about four-years old, believe it or not, I preferred handsome to pretty.) Its all this cumulative effect of a thousand minuscule moments. I mean so far, knock on wood, Im getting to see my kids be much, much older than she got to see her kids be. Kelly shares a graduation speech, a conversation about takeaways from high school with her daughter and a special reading with Oscar winning actress Helen Hunt. The Best Show is the best live podcast you're ever gonna hear! It just ends the tension because what youre saying is, I see it how you see it, and I agree with you. A phrase that I heard at a recent Pecha Kucha talk from a woman who had come through a terrible health crisis was Its like this now. Read more about this episode, and get show notes, here. Michael Lewis sends his thanks to Dr. Arthur White, a former history teacher at Isidore Newman School in New Orleans, Louisiana, for kicking him in class whenever hed fall asleep. Youre giving these beautiful phrases, and each of them feels like a kind of roadmap, and you start with one that really resonated deeply with me. Inspiring and thought-provoking interviews conducted by bestselling author Kelly Corrigan. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. The idea that we just sort of wander around, consume things until we die, like were just a series of small appetites without any deep, rich, meaningful, satisfying connection. I hope you continue sharing your thoughts and joining in the conversation! Kate Bowler:Yeah. 00:35:25 - Annie Jean Baptiste in the Head of Product Inclusion at Google where she spends her time thinking about the products we use very day and how who's a I mean, that was my big experience of your book. Onward, my dears. I rebelled. Kate Bowler:Well I think part of it, and this gets to another phrase that you write about which is I dont know, but you and I, it sounds like, have given up on certainties as a way to cope with that, both having been through cancer, and also I think both realizing that people really dont like it when you say, I dont know.. I was wrong not to go visit her. Take 2 - Father Greg Boyle on Character, Change and Kindness Dosing Kilpy Then the ocean with its waves so vast, impossible to touch bottom, then a maze, then a mountain, then seasons, a natural disaster. Its these seemingly trivial moments. Thats the word. On Sundays, Kelly records a special podcast called, "Thanks for Being Here" where she reads the toasts and tributes that listeners have submitted about those they love. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. I love it that it gives up perfectionism, and it just says, Hey, whats possible today?. I guess everybody here, these children of mine and my husband, are just too damn busy to get on this, but Im not, so Ill do it, and then I was finishing, and I found a little pile of cut toenails on my kitchen table, and that. This episode was wonderful, wasnt it? Im sorry I didnt go see your mom. Thats not the same as saying I was wrong not to try to know her. Kelly Corrigan:Youre feeling like ABC, not DEF. So thats the beauty of it. Ten days before I was scheduled to defend my dissertation, English Policies, Curricular Reform and Teacher Development in Multilingual, Post-colonial Djibouti, I got the call. Thank you for adding to the number of not-normal, cry-at-the-drop-of-a-hat people in the world. Kelly Corrigan:So, I had to wait, and then finally we had a window, and I said, I was wrong. My mom called me maybe three months after my dad died. Thats my other life mantra. They thrill, and confound, and circle, and overflow, and disappear, because its like this, having a life.. Kate Bowler:Thanks so much for doing this. The idea that any day could be this huge day, I dont know, that really gets me out of bed, you know? Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Like, Im just an ordinary person, and I make all the mistakes that everybody else makes and maybe even 10% more, and then there she was, and what she would have done for the life that I was kind of rushing through, multitasking my way through day, after day, and you know, sort of feeling snappish, and then catching myself, and feeling like I should be different. Describing the middle school drama teacher as the first person who believed in her, she imparts her gratitude for him coming to her defense as a young student. That kind of belonging is transcendent, and you just feel it pop up in these little moments. Lang Lang and Gina Alice play the piano in Lafayette, CA. The book is full of warm and witty blessings found within the struggles of our shared humanity, from theNew York Timesbestselling authors ofGood Enough. Kelly Corrigan:Its like a game changer. It was the very last thing that I wrote, and you may be able to relate to this, theres always one part of a book that writes itself, at least for me, where its like, I guess Ive been thinking about this long enough, I guess Ive been living this long enough that its all kind of been subconsciously forming, and now Im just about taking dictation here, and thats the way that was. Kilpy My life doesnt exactly fit into neat categories anymore. Im so glad youve been plugging in and hope to keep hearing your feedback! Suddenly, just showing up was in question. The Big Short, Moneyball, Liars Poker, these stories stand for whole industries because Michael Lewis puts just the right protagonist in the center. Teri Rose wrote this loving remembrance of her son Ryland. Thanks for the rebellion and the reminder that we as women take up space, take risks, and even make mistakes! Leave a review on Apple Podcasts. You know, like it wasnt me. Each episode ends with a special Plus One segment, in which guests are invited to thank those that have supported them along their journey. Best, Kelly Corrigan:Have you ever heard that potted plant theory? So, thats just the question in front of all of us. Ryland was a light in this world who struggled with anxiety, depression and addiction. Its completely random. Kelly Corrigan speaks with Maya Shankar about identity foreclosure, the trouble of cognitive forecasting, and new beginnings. And the potted plant theory, I cant credit it to someone, Im sorry, I dont know who put it out there, but the idea is that if you were to have a plant in your kitchen, you might not be aware of it at all, and then if someone were to remove it, youd say What happened to that plant?. Kate Bowler:Yeah, the indignity. Oh, The People You'll Know!. Graduations, diminished though they may Were just a series of days and interactions.
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